SirAgent appeals

Author Message
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SirAgent
Date sent: 2019/07/29 21:32:14
Username: SirAgent

Banned about 5 hours ago (4:30 UTC)

I was banned for conspiracy to steal. I had a new faction member join and ask me if he could steal from other factions. At first, I told him to not tell me about anything he stole because I didn't want to be involved or face trouble for it. Then, I heard how far he wanted to take it (leaving other factions and rejoining), and I told him not to do any of it. None of this took place in chat so there probably aren't logs of it, but once I heard what he wanted to do, I asked him not to. At no point did I support stealing from other factions. It is possible that some beacons and iron that I was given by this new member were stolen, but I am not aware, as of writing this appeal, that these items were stolen. They were given to me by the faction member with no statements that they were stolen and had no reason to believe that they were when I received them.
Ninja Edit: I'm appealing because I did not support any stealing, and any items that may or may not have been stolen were not known to me to be stolen. Therefore, I do not believe I deserve a ban for conspiracy to steal.
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legomine709
Date sent: 2019/07/29 22:27:53
+1
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Presinus
Date sent: 2019/07/30 06:53:39
-1 you took from me though
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rida
Date sent: 2019/07/30 08:13:29
-1
You knew they were stealing, you should have not allowed them back
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Aouldrain
Date sent: 2019/07/30 08:46:49
-1
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SirAgent
Date sent: 2019/07/30 10:07:41
In response to rida, no 'allowing them back' occurred. I invited them once, and came back the next day to be banned without ever having done anything.

Pres what have I ever taken from you?

Aould tEmP mOD bIas!!1!!!1! cause you were the one that banned me.

in seriousness though, if you have concerns, I want to address them.
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Aouldrain
Date sent: 2019/07/30 10:27:55
I wasn't the one who banned you, Tam banned you.

I uncovered the entire operation when investigating Maxrockford, and discovering that he was active in areas where you were.
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SirAgent
Date sent: 2019/07/30 10:44:46
Just to be clear, the faction member you named had only been in my faction for probably about 24 hours when he was banned. And when you say "the entire operation" I would like to know what you are talking about (more details), given that since I did not encourage or request any stealing, I know nothing about.
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SirAgent
Date sent: 2019/07/30 21:31:03
Apparently since Tam banned me I should ask for him. @tamnica
Edit: Apparently that doesn't work so I'm bad at forums.
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Presinus
Date sent: 2019/07/31 05:18:07
You conned me outta my slimeballs and made an attempt to take em all when I was goofing with the prices
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tamnica
Date sent: 2019/07/31 08:03:15
I agree that image says a thousand words so I will keep my response image heavy

The sheer fact that you used signs to communicate and thus avoid making chat logs is extremely suspicious. Not only any signs, but signs that detail how your stealing process will work.

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So maxrockford would steal the items while you would share them. (keep in mind that furnaces were placed after to cover up the signs) That was the original plan tho.

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Now there are some signs that are younger (placed after) others, they seem like you do not agree with the stealing scheme

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But the thing is, they are made some time after the ones that detail the plan.
Tho even them show the shady nature of the operation, you wanting to "maintain deniability"

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Then some more signs that show that you actually do not want to work with him

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Looks simple now, siragent was offered the deal and he respectfully declined the offer and kept honorable (didnt report the scheme to staff tho, so a bit shady)

And then we got this

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Right after removing all the signs siragent placed a shulker box there

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Shulker box was filled with some of the contraband goods while other part was thrown to siragent and he picked it up into his inventory.

I go to siragents base then, find the same shulker box

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And find logs of the 48 iron blocks being removed from it.

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And here we see all the contraband (hundreds of iron blocks, some from being thrown by maxrockford and picked up by siragent and 6 beacons) unloaded into siragents storage at his base.

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So with all this in mind whats the verdict? There is obvious proof of you two scheming, items were stolen and they all ended up in your base. Not to mention that the maxrockford was accepted into your faction called America right after he left the faction Finnmark when he robbed them blind.

Entered other faction and got their trust - confirmed
Stole - confirmed
Left the faction and was invited to your faction - confirmed
Shared the spoils - confirmed
Guilty - ?

I think its pretty obvious what goes instead of the question mark there.
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Medic
Date sent: 2019/07/31 08:13:16
-1

you could have just accepted the ban knowing you did wrong. Lying did you no good.
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SirAgent
Date sent: 2019/07/31 10:59:45
Alright, thanks for responding Tamnica. I have a few responses because I still contend my innocence. I do not deny that I accepted stolen items, I only deny that I knew they were stolen.
Additionally, I did not place the signs or furnaces pictured in the first two images. Since these signs are clearly accessible, there should be no logs of me placing these. Do logs indicate that I placed any of those signs?

Yes, I did place the signs in the last 3. That is our conversation. But what happens to the story when you go back to that building and check the logs, and see that I didn't place those signs?

Quick Edit: The first sign I placed said something like "what are you thinking?" (Not pictured)
I also said
- I'd prefer if you didn't
- Don't tell me about it
- Maintain deniability
- That's too far for me
- I'd prefer to remain ethical.
These were all I placed and should be viewed with the understanding that I never saw the first sets of signs.

Additionally, there is no sign placed by me detailing a plan or accepting any stealing. The farthest I was willing to go was turn a blind eye, but after I heard he wanted to join other factions to scam them I said "that's too far for me sorry." If I'm telling the person who I supposedly already did this plan with that I don't like this plan, something must be off.

Finally, there's a bit of a timeline problem here, which is why I believed none of the items I received were stolen. I was shown the beacons before this conversation took place, because he placed them on the ground near my flower farm. He was already in the faction at the time, and that was the first time I was aware of the beacons. My reaction in chat was "that's a lot of beacons" and I believed that they were his.

After he was known to have beacons, he then asked if he could start stealing. I believed, since he was in Finnmark, that nobody there would stand for stealing and he had gotten his beacons (and accompanying 3 stacks of iron blocks) legitimately. I did not think, given that he was asking to start stealing, that he had already begun.

To be clear, I am basing this response on the hope that you are willing to investigate just a little more, and check out the logs on the signs I am claiming I did not place.
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SirAgent
Date sent: 2019/07/31 11:23:28
One thing I just remembered: I can honestly say there was no communication between us about stealing before he joined the faction. If necessary to prove my innocence (I did not ask him to steal from Finnmark), I can record myself unzipping my log files for that date, which have not been modified. I can also email them to be examined in full.

I now recall seeing the signs in the second image, but I did not place them. These were placed in context of a conversation where I responded in chat to talking about the faction. My logs should corroborate this. I would still like a staff to investigate who placed the signs in the first two images.
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SirAgent
Date sent: 2019/07/31 17:04:10
Final thing before I get a response: the conversation saying that he wanted to steal took place after he was already invited into the faction. I assume the items that were stolen could only have been taken before I invited him since apparently they came from his previous faction. And I clearly could not have asked him to steal items from a faction w he was no longer in
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tamnica
Date sent: 2019/08/01 08:32:39
While I work on recreating the full timeline of events to bring the whole incident closer to being solved I have to ask you this:

You turning a blind eye to a player trying to for a stealing scheme is bad in itself btw

So you are trying to tell us that you rejected any form of cooperation on a stealing scheme, but right after that rejection you placed down a shulker box and received some valuable items (48 iron blocks). Around that time you received 6 beacons and 20- ish iron blocks from maxrockford and unloaded it all into your base.

I just want to be clear on this. You denied any form of involvement in stealing, but you agreed to take some really valuable items right after that rejection and you did not find that suspicious?

Also, asking you for any logs of that day is pointless since you already showed the willingness to use other methods of communication (methods that do not leave logs) when illegal activity is involved
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SirAgent
Date sent: 2019/08/01 09:44:01
Yes, I admit to doing everything you've listed here (turn a blind eye, unthinkingly take stolen items, bypass chat logs), except actually plan any (and obviously commit) theft.

That's everything I said I did in the first post of this appeal.

It doesn't make sense that somebody steals from their old faction, joins mine, asks to start stealing for me, and then somehow I asked them to steal from their old faction before we even had the conversation.

It was 6 beacons and just under 3 stacks of iron blocks by the way. I honestly thought he was giving me a full beacon setup of his. In retrospect, I definitely should have suspected something was off, but I did not at the time.
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Aouldrain
Date sent: 2019/08/01 16:59:42
If i were you, I'd just wait for the ban to be up. It is, after all, temporary.
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tamnica
Date sent: 2019/08/03 16:30:26
The more the investigation goes the more same conclusion comes to mind.
You did not do any stealing, you did turn a blind eye to illegal activities, you did have the stolen items and you were offered part in a stealing scheme. Whether you accepted or not cannot be confirmed with 100% certainty.

Ban reduced to 4 days
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SirAgent
Date sent: 2019/08/07 01:07:36
Byn you still think I'm lying?
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Presinus
Date sent: 2019/08/07 12:14:41
Little did SirAgent know, one of his balls are impotent and he produces less testosterone than a virgin vegan

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